I am excited to read Hurston's book with you. I was never assigned this book in any of my classes, and when I read it last summer I was embarrassed to realize that I had somehow overlooked one of the most amazing masterpieces in our literature. This is one of my favorite books. I am curious to see what you all think. The novel is tight, but perhaps not quite as tight as Gatsby, and I'm afraid you might feel it's a let-down, but I think it is very nearly as intensely written, and Hurston performs much more amazing feats of ventriloquism than Fitzgerald attempts. I hope you end up seeing that this book is as virtuosic as Gatsby, and maybe even more mature, because less ironic.
Monday, April 25, 2011
Through chapter 4
What do you think so far? What do you like? There is so much going on: the remarkable figurative language, the gender stuff, the distinct narrations, etc....
The thing that really jumped out at was me was when on page 14 when Nanny says in a very insightful way that "De nigger woman is de mule uh de world so fur as Ah can see". I think her view that this circumstance came about because black women were at the bottom of America's societal power structure is a modern one and also despite you saying in class that Zora Neale Hurston was conservative, a progressive one. Right now, the book is optimistic about Janie taking progressive stances to make her life better but we know she ends up returning to town empty handed so I wonder if that in the end will reflect a disapproval with Janie and her radical ways.
I love how Janie starts the story in her own voice, but it continues with the voice of the narrator, who relates Janie's deepest feelings, things she might not necessarily say if she were telling the story aloud. Usually I am angry towards characters like Janie, who seem ungrateful for the good things in their lives in comparison to her grandmother, who has clearly had a very hard life. However, Janie's beautiful, innocent belief that marriage must bring love completely won me over, and realizing that she was the same age as me when she was forced into something she didn't understand also garnered my sympathy for her character. Why should she settle for anything less than love even though other women in her family have experienced much worse? I also love Hurston's writing style, especially her descriptions of the changing seasons and the pear tree. - Catherine Marris
Although Hurston's writing took a little getting used to (even the "normal" voice, not just with the accent), it's really beautiful and poetic. The phrases are concise and to the point, but underneath there is a lot more meaning woven into the story than meets the eye. Reading as Janie tries to find love, it reminds me a little bit of the Henry James story we read, where the main character is waiting for something great to happen in his life, and there's a ton of build up throughout the story. This worries me because I don't want to be disappointed in the end if she never finds love, especially after abandonning her first husband when she runs away with Joe.
I think this is a very interesting book and I am very tempted to read ahead. I think we will be in for quiet a ride and it is hard to imagine that thins is just the beginning for it seems like many important things have already happened. I am excited to continue. As much as the Grandmother just wanted to help Janie it is not right that she would simply marry her away at the first chance possible. I like Pheoby the most so far.
Although this book is incredibly difficult to read, it is also very rewarding. I realized I have come to dread the paragraphs of dialog, but I love the paragraphs in-between. The prose is incredible. As for the speech, I have to read it very carefully to understand what they are saying, but once I do, I realize their words are very profound. Like Sarah, I hope things will turn out well in the end for Janie.
Like almost everyone else so far, I love the prose of Hurston's descriptions (especially in the first two pages) because it is beautiful and unusual. It seems to depict the feeling of events and places, giving the reader an almost stronger sense of their physical characteristics. There is also that sharp quality to it, and how she presents small things that most people feel or notice in ways that at first seem abstract but clarify once you realize what she is writing about, even if it is in some way you could never put in words, just a vague feeling. I like her word choice and sentence structure that makes you stop and pay attention to what she is saying and to what is being described (like with the pear tree and bees and all that they symbolize). I feel like this is going to be a book with many profound sentences that could stand alone and still hold the same gravity.
Like Amanda, I've found the dialog to be slow reading, mostly because I can't stop myself from reading the accent to myself in my head, which takes a lot longer. I did find, like other people did, that Hurston's writing is profound and intense. She almost seems to be laying down truths that she has learned over a lifetime through her characters, especially Nanny, and in her descriptions. I was particularly struck by the line "Janie's first dream was dead, so she became a woman". Hurston doesn't really explain this further, but lets the idea stand as a sort of absolute truth, which requires no expansion. I think these short, powerful sentences contrast her more descriptive, ornate phrases (like her description of the pear tree), and this gives them more integrity to stand by themselves. I think this also differentiates her writing from Fitzgeralds'. The movement of this book seems to be different- faster, more event based, and oddly more concrete, whereas Gatsby had a dreamlike, floating quality and a storyline that progressed slowly and easily.
Although the end of the first chapter sets up that we'll be learning about Janie's past, this book is different from other "recollection" books I've read. As most previous posts have said, the style of description is complex but gives the book its unique quality. Imagery is interwoven with events and thoughts that I haven't seen other authors use in the same way. At the end of chapter 4, Hurston writes, "From now on until death she was going to have flower dust and springtime sprinkled over everything. A bee for her bloom." This is one of the less complex descriptions that about flowers and bees that we've encountered so far, but I this simpler image connects with the more ornate ones in previous chapters, providing narrative cohesion and further strengthening Janie's motives for leaving her husband. This book is a time-consuming read, but reading it feels worth it to experience Hurston's different style.
I'm going to have to go with everyone else he and say that her extremely uniqued voiced description, and separately but uniquely voiced narrator jumped out to me. I haven't had much problem with understanding the dialogue is generally her voicing of the characters is not so much a changing of the word in its entirety, but usually taking off bits and pieces. The first chapter started off with a bang with incredible description, and changes pace very abruptly with the rough dialogue of the women on the porch. Overall, a hell of a way to start a book.
I thought the story itself was rather, self-incriminating. To be honest while I do respect Janie's opinion on love, her personality seems somewhat shallow, but could we blame her grandma? She didn't love Logan, and she left him, but her grandma wanted her to marry Logan. Not entirely sure, I thought Janie may have been a little mean, but I still think Logan could have tried better? I am not entirely sure.
My first impression of the book was "woah...this book is incredibly tedious to read. My English homework is going to take hours to complete!" However, after devoting the time to read and understand the difficult dialogue, the controversial depiction of race and gender immediately grabbed my attention. For a politically conservative author in the early 19th century, she seems rather revolutionary and daring. Not to sound too much like an obnoxious feminist, but I appreciate Janie's strong independent personality and her courage to walk away from a marriage that she was forced into.
First off, the dialogue was pretty difficult for me to understand, reminded me of The Adventure of Huck Finn, but I guess I will get used to it soon. Then I felt like Janie was always controlled by other people's decisions for her until chapter 4 she decides to leave Logan and go with Joe. Other than the dialogues, the description parts were very thoughtful and descriptive, like the scene when Janie is under the tree before she kissed the guy when she was sixteen. Overall, I like the beginning of this book.
I really like the book so far. I think the language is very interesting. The difference between the colloquial writing and the figurative writing is very distinct, however there seems to be some cross over. The accent that Hurston creates connotes a negative or slightly demeaning attitude towards those characters, although at the same time, those characters speak with the same prestige and metaphorical language.
I enjoyed chapter 2. I thought it was really nicely written at the end. Daniel was right when he said in class that Janie was sort of in between the description of a man and a women in chapter 1. Janie was extrememly romantic throughout chapter 2 longing for love and when she realised that you can't marry someone and then fall in love she "became a woman" (25). Taking that into account, what Hurston thinks men are- dreamers, I think, I may be wrong, Jody's dreams will not come true and their relationship will end because what Janie loves about Jody is his dreams. - Amina
WOW. Mind blown. For a 1930's novel by an African American woman, there is some edgy stuff in here. Unlike Huck Finn, I did not have too much trouble getting used to the colloquial dialogue. Janie is also a refreshing change from the other protagonists we've read about this year. She has the ability to view things from both perspectives, and is very independent, which you can tell from the book's context is something uncommon for women at the time.
I think it's interesting how Janie always talks about family - well, her lack of family growing up. it seems that this lack of childhood contributes to her difficult time growing up. She is forced to become a woman - marriage and children - but is not fitting into that position.
When the book began, it seemed to be at the end of Janie's story. When it became clear that she would be relating her story, I expected to hear more about Tea Cake, whom she recently left. I was surprised to see that by chapter four, Janie has already had relationships with two or three other men, none of them Tea Cake. It seems to me that Janie will be on a journey to find the perfect partner during this book.
Along with Amina, I also really liked the end of chapter two, in which Janie became a woman. I felt that this was a prime example of the abstract statement made about women and men at the beginning of the book - Janie is putting away her dream of a perfect world where "marriage compels love, as the sun compels the day." We also see this practical aspect later on during Janie's reaction to her fights with Logan. I think the language used in this book is beautiful and has been chosen very carefully to give a specific image or feeling.
As I began reading Their Eyes Were Watching God I was immediately drawn to the similarities to other works we have read. Like many of the novels we have read this book starts with a different introduction that can be bracketed from the rest of the novel. Another clear connection is to the colloquial language and phonetic spelling for African American dialogue in Huck Finn. As we talked about in class there are parallels to TSL in the opening scene. There are obvious similarities to Incidents in The Life of a Slave Girl. All that said TEWWG has a very unique feel to it both linguistically (with its juxtaposition of romance and colloquialism) and overall
I feel like Janie is extremely immature and self centered. Nanny only wants the best for her but Janie seems to do what Janie feels like doing. Agreed that Logan is a truly troubled man, and often can be seen as cruel, I doubt that his wickedness stems from his and Janie's relationship. I have noticed how fast paced this novel is, which makes Janie's life with Nanny and Logan seem pretty insignificant and what happens later may be far more important. --Nathan R.
I dont understand what Janie meant when she said that TeaCake was "gone." However, she told Pheoby a couple things that didnt happen. At the rate that this book is going, we will eventually hear again of this story soon. At the beginning of the first chapter, we are told that "the dream is the truth." Janie does not like Logan, which is true, and she does not seem to be liking him anymore as time goes on. Janie is not being truthful to herself, thus she is not living her dream at the moment. However, according to the beginning of the book, she will just forget this moment and pursue a new dream as all women do.
It was very interesting (and sad, of course) to read about the history of Nanny, Leafy, and Janie. There were 3 whole generations of slavery, suffering, and cruelty. I'm glad that Janie defied that and left Logan; he is clearly not right for her. She is altering history and changing what happens in their family.
I am going to say that the intense, serious, deep, and reflective paragraphs in between the dialogues intrigued me alot. However, along with everyone else, I agree that the dialogues were a little harder to read, since I had to say it aloud in my head in order for me to grasp what the characters were trying to articulate. This book was not like other books whereby I can just breeze through the reading. However, this book seemed rewarding enough in descriptions and deep, insightful sentences. I wanted to point out how much contempt I have for Mayrella and the other bullies who tried to make Janie feel bad. If those girls had so much fun bullying poor Janie, I seriously hope karma has something good installed for them. I really enjoyed reading about her contemplative moment under the blossoming pear tree, as I have never really understood how such simple things in life could be so profound and so ... sweet. The tranquility of that moment seemed to me like a sanctuary against the horrid and poignant comments about her parents. I hate the way Janie's grandma broke it to Janie that the whites were racist and treated blacks like lesser beings, "throw down de load and tell de nigger man tuh pick it up" and I hated the way the black men "hand it to his womenfolks." So what now? The black men felt that their ego was hurt by the white men, so they forced their wives to do their work and shoulder the labor? Are they now channeling their bruised ego to sexism and making their wives slaves? "de nigger woman is de mule" (page 14) I feel bad for her grandma because I understand how marrying a white man would get her protection from the world, seeing how she was abandoned by both parents. That stupid plantation woman also had some serious issues. So now what? Because Janie's grandma had a baby who looks a little white meant that it gave her the right to slap the poor woman? Like I previously said, I really want to see what karma has installed for her. (edit: I just realized Janie's grandma was raped by the plantation owner; that makes me sympathize even more with the poor woman) I found it touching the way Janie's grandma went through all that trouble to raise Janie's mum, and eventually Janie herself. I was so upset when Zora Hurston killed off Janie's grandma, the only woman in this story that I really took a liking to. After all that she had done, the last thing she deserved was to die in a single paragraph. That's about the worst thing a writer can do. *grumbles* Joe said "Ah'm uh man wid principles" Yeah right! Lets go seduce married woman and inspire them to elope with us, I mean, we are men with principles, right? >.> Come on Janie, your husband has barely been gone for a month and you are having an affair? He has been doing all the hard work and now you want to ditch him? Wow much... And in the end she ditched him. That poor man married Janie and was reduced to a sobbing mess, and she ditched him for a flirtatious man. Ugh. - End of random rambles -
Janie's life thus far is very restricted. Due to racism and her gender Janie has no room to move. I really enjoy the style of the writing so far and can't wait to read more about Janie's life.
Thanks for your comments so far. I am interested that the dialogue is difficult. I guess it's difficult for me, too, but I really enjoy reading it, because it sounds like real people talking to me--and I like the way they seem to say so much more than a lot of other people. The issues are right out there in the open: like when Nanny tells Janie what she's worried about, or Janie and Logan discuss their marriage. And the dialogue strikes me often as nearly as beautiful as the paragraphs in between. On a side note, I'm not sure why Talia should feel shy about saying she likes it that Janie's an independent woman. Feminism should be admirable, not obnoxious. --EC
I really like Hurston's style of giving mostly dialogue. It let me know each character better because of the way they said things, rather than by showing the way they acted. Janie's life seems to be very affected by race. Although it doesn't seem as though she has had too much contact with real rough racism, race has defined her life. From when she realized she was not in fact white by seeing a picture of herself her life changed. At school she was made fun of because of her affiliation with white people, a strange twist on racism. And now she is embarking to an all black town to live in. Clearly race is going to play a huge role there. I am interested in seeing where the story will take her. As of now she seems to have no limits besides race; she's with a wealthy man, has no ties at home, and is on the road.
I agree with Matt in that it seems that Janie actually has quite a bit of freedom, especially when she runs of with Jody. At the same time, she is always in danger of being taken advantage of. It seems as if Hurston is foreshadowing that Janie will soon have to undergo some struggles however.
Though I love the book so far, I really dislike Janie. While I feel bad for her seeing as that she is a dreamer in a world in which she is forced to face harsh realities, her spoiled bratishness makes her extremely unlikable. After hearing how much Nanny went through for her, instead of respecting that, she just pouts and then complains about her husband until she finally leaves him for a man with such high principles that he sees no problem in encouraging a married woman to run away with him. It's one thing to not love or be attracted to her husband, but she takes it to an awful new level by complaining about instead of appreciating all the work he does for her in return for so little. What upset me the most was how she seemed to wait for Nanny to die to disregard all the promises she had made to her. Her actions may be independent, but are by no means shown in an attractive light.
I really like how the scenes are constructed with interesting and specific details. I find the dialogue a little difficult to read, but I enjoy the way it sounds in my head. It sounds very real, as did the dialogue in Huck Finn. The scene when Janie is under the pear tree is quite dramatic and dreamy, and t
really hate the main character Janie. The book fails in one of almost every books' objectives of making the reader care for the main protagonist in the book. Despite Janie's troubles, she is no where as unfortunate as the stereotypical lives of a slave we hear about. Even within the book there are minor characters in which we find more notiable traits/feel bad for as Nanny and Nanny's first child(the mother of Janie) both gets raped. However, Janie never gets raped and never really gets beaten.
I agree a lot with Ayesha despite weighting what was written above to be of enough importance to tip my general idea of the book to a more negative view
I find it interesting how it switches from narration to conversation. I think the beginning pages that we read in class had so much detail and imagery but when reading the conversation parts I feel like I am able to get a better feel for the tone and what is actually going on even though the narration has such great deep detail.
Despite the difficult dialogue, I am really enjoying the book. I like Janie so far because despite her hardship, she stands up for herself. She knows what she wants and fights for it instead of agreeing to the false love she is forced into with Logan by Nanny. I am particularly interested in finding out the role God plays in the novel and how religion or spirituality affects Janie.
I have really enjoyed the beginning. I agree with Jamie that the difference between the dialogue and the rest is so distinct and big. It seems a little strange that the descriptions are so detailed and somewhat complex, and the dialogue seems as if it could be coming from a different book altogether.
Having just read Wuthering Heights over the break, the storytelling aspect of this novel is not as confusing as it would have been - for me, at least. I've always wondered why authors choose to tell stories through other people. That point aside, the beginning is one of the best and most intriguing that I have read in a long time. We learn that Janie is mixed, and that her grandmother felt that God had bestowed her a second chance - another child with whom to create a good future. While I'm still curious about Janie's parents - her mother, in particular - we can make many conjectures about Janie's life. The novel focuses on love and the social conception surrounding marriage; Janie, who probably sought a deeper kind of love-enriched marriage than other girls her age, was unhappy at her gruff, slightly socially awkward but overwhelmingly kind and benevolent husband, who had difficulty expressing his delight in their companionship - but their marriage was ONLY a companionship, and nothing else. When a flashy and socially hip young man came around, she was blinded by his soothing words and ran off with him. I don't dislike Janie, per se, but I acknowledge that she has flaws but she also has high aspirations to live a fulfilling life; that's admirable.
The author definently wants to show the reader that Janie is independent. We see this by her leaving the man the her nanny wanted her to marry. It shows Janie as an adventurous, free spirit. I am curious to see what happens to Janie as a result of her attitude.
So far I have enjoyed the novel, although I feel that it is almost two different books. For it is either difficult and choppy dialogue, or well thought out, beautifully written, descriptions. However, what ties these sides of the book together is the the fact that they both seem to address big issues and they both use lots of metaphors. Henry Lucey
I feel that the dialogue of this book is mirroring the speech almost of Jim in Huck Finn, which going forward may present issues of understanding necessarily what Janie or others are saying. I do feel that it is being used to convey a similar point of the common speech and opinions of the time against African Americans.
I have enjoyed the book. At first i was a bit confused with the word choices Zora Neale Hurston made but as i read on, I began to piece the puzzle together. What i enjoyed so far was the part when Janie's grandmother was trying to make Janie marry Jonny.
I HATE THIS WRITING! This is so annoying, it's like a hardcore version of Huckleberry Finn, I don't really gets whats going on, and I have to read it out loud a good 6 times before I actually understand it. I'm sure the story is good past all the annoying misspelling and such.
I'm finding the dialect and the writing style really interesting as well. If you try to imagine people actually talking, it's much easier and flows better. But it can be tricky. Overall, I'm enjoying the book so far. It seems that there are many stories within stories and interesting characters. I got so lost in the stories of Nanny and Logan that I even forgot that Janie was even talking to Pheoby in the first place. I don't feel like I know enough about Janie to decide whether I like her or not yet, but she seems to be an adventurous, thoughtful, curious girl and I find her quite relatable in those ways. -Elena
The thing that really jumped out at was me was when on page 14 when Nanny says in a very insightful way that "De nigger woman is de mule uh de world so fur as Ah can see". I think her view that this circumstance came about because black women were at the bottom of America's societal power structure is a modern one and also despite you saying in class that Zora Neale Hurston was conservative, a progressive one. Right now, the book is optimistic about Janie taking progressive stances to make her life better but we know she ends up returning to town empty handed so I wonder if that in the end will reflect a disapproval with Janie and her radical ways.
ReplyDeleteI love how Janie starts the story in her own voice, but it continues with the voice of the narrator, who relates Janie's deepest feelings, things she might not necessarily say if she were telling the story aloud. Usually I am angry towards characters like Janie, who seem ungrateful for the good things in their lives in comparison to her grandmother, who has clearly had a very hard life. However, Janie's beautiful, innocent belief that marriage must bring love completely won me over, and realizing that she was the same age as me when she was forced into something she didn't understand also garnered my sympathy for her character. Why should she settle for anything less than love even though other women in her family have experienced much worse? I also love Hurston's writing style, especially her descriptions of the changing seasons and the pear tree.
ReplyDelete- Catherine Marris
Although Hurston's writing took a little getting used to (even the "normal" voice, not just with the accent), it's really beautiful and poetic. The phrases are concise and to the point, but underneath there is a lot more meaning woven into the story than meets the eye.
ReplyDeleteReading as Janie tries to find love, it reminds me a little bit of the Henry James story we read, where the main character is waiting for something great to happen in his life, and there's a ton of build up throughout the story. This worries me because I don't want to be disappointed in the end if she never finds love, especially after abandonning her first husband when she runs away with Joe.
I think this is a very interesting book and I am very tempted to read ahead. I think we will be in for quiet a ride and it is hard to imagine that thins is just the beginning for it seems like many important things have already happened. I am excited to continue. As much as the Grandmother just wanted to help Janie it is not right that she would simply marry her away at the first chance possible. I like Pheoby the most so far.
ReplyDeleteAlthough this book is incredibly difficult to read, it is also very rewarding. I realized I have come to dread the paragraphs of dialog, but I love the paragraphs in-between. The prose is incredible. As for the speech, I have to read it very carefully to understand what they are saying, but once I do, I realize their words are very profound. Like Sarah, I hope things will turn out well in the end for Janie.
ReplyDeleteLike almost everyone else so far, I love the prose of Hurston's descriptions (especially in the first two pages) because it is beautiful and unusual. It seems to depict the feeling of events and places, giving the reader an almost stronger sense of their physical characteristics. There is also that sharp quality to it, and how she presents small things that most people feel or notice in ways that at first seem abstract but clarify once you realize what she is writing about, even if it is in some way you could never put in words, just a vague feeling. I like her word choice and sentence structure that makes you stop and pay attention to what she is saying and to what is being described (like with the pear tree and bees and all that they symbolize). I feel like this is going to be a book with many profound sentences that could stand alone and still hold the same gravity.
ReplyDeleteLike Amanda, I've found the dialog to be slow reading, mostly because I can't stop myself from reading the accent to myself in my head, which takes a lot longer. I did find, like other people did, that Hurston's writing is profound and intense. She almost seems to be laying down truths that she has learned over a lifetime through her characters, especially Nanny, and in her descriptions. I was particularly struck by the line "Janie's first dream was dead, so she became a woman". Hurston doesn't really explain this further, but lets the idea stand as a sort of absolute truth, which requires no expansion. I think these short, powerful sentences contrast her more descriptive, ornate phrases (like her description of the pear tree), and this gives them more integrity to stand by themselves. I think this also differentiates her writing from Fitzgeralds'. The movement of this book seems to be different- faster, more event based, and oddly more concrete, whereas Gatsby had a dreamlike, floating quality and a storyline that progressed slowly and easily.
ReplyDeleteAlthough the end of the first chapter sets up that we'll be learning about Janie's past, this book is different from other "recollection" books I've read. As most previous posts have said, the style of description is complex but gives the book its unique quality. Imagery is interwoven with events and thoughts that I haven't seen other authors use in the same way. At the end of chapter 4, Hurston writes, "From now on until death she was going to have flower dust and springtime sprinkled over everything. A bee for her bloom." This is one of the less complex descriptions that about flowers and bees that we've encountered so far, but I this simpler image connects with the more ornate ones in previous chapters, providing narrative cohesion and further strengthening Janie's motives for leaving her husband. This book is a time-consuming read, but reading it feels worth it to experience Hurston's different style.
ReplyDeleteI'm going to have to go with everyone else he and say that her extremely uniqued voiced description, and separately but uniquely voiced narrator jumped out to me. I haven't had much problem with understanding the dialogue is generally her voicing of the characters is not so much a changing of the word in its entirety, but usually taking off bits and pieces. The first chapter started off with a bang with incredible description, and changes pace very abruptly with the rough dialogue of the women on the porch. Overall, a hell of a way to start a book.
ReplyDeleteI thought the story itself was rather, self-incriminating. To be honest while I do respect Janie's opinion on love, her personality seems somewhat shallow, but could we blame her grandma? She didn't love Logan, and she left him, but her grandma wanted her to marry Logan. Not entirely sure, I thought Janie may have been a little mean, but I still think Logan could have tried better? I am not entirely sure.
ReplyDeleteMy first impression of the book was "woah...this book is incredibly tedious to read. My English homework is going to take hours to complete!" However, after devoting the time to read and understand the difficult dialogue, the controversial depiction of race and gender immediately grabbed my attention. For a politically conservative author in the early 19th century, she seems rather revolutionary and daring. Not to sound too much like an obnoxious feminist, but I appreciate Janie's strong independent personality and her courage to walk away from a marriage that she was forced into.
ReplyDeleteFirst off, the dialogue was pretty difficult for me to understand, reminded me of The Adventure of Huck Finn, but I guess I will get used to it soon. Then I felt like Janie was always controlled by other people's decisions for her until chapter 4 she decides to leave Logan and go with Joe. Other than the dialogues, the description parts were very thoughtful and descriptive, like the scene when Janie is under the tree before she kissed the guy when she was sixteen. Overall, I like the beginning of this book.
ReplyDeleteI really like the book so far. I think the language is very interesting. The difference between the colloquial writing and the figurative writing is very distinct, however there seems to be some cross over. The accent that Hurston creates connotes a negative or slightly demeaning attitude towards those characters, although at the same time, those characters speak with the same prestige and metaphorical language.
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed chapter 2. I thought it was really nicely written at the end. Daniel was right when he said in class that Janie was sort of in between the description of a man and a women in chapter 1. Janie was extrememly romantic throughout chapter 2 longing for love and when she realised that you can't marry someone and then fall in love she "became a woman" (25). Taking that into account, what Hurston thinks men are- dreamers, I think, I may be wrong, Jody's dreams will not come true and their relationship will end because what Janie loves about Jody is his dreams. - Amina
ReplyDeleteWOW. Mind blown. For a 1930's novel by an African American woman, there is some edgy stuff in here. Unlike Huck Finn, I did not have too much trouble getting used to the colloquial dialogue.
ReplyDeleteJanie is also a refreshing change from the other protagonists we've read about this year. She has the ability to view things from both perspectives, and is very independent, which you can tell from the book's context is something uncommon for women at the time.
I think it's interesting how Janie always talks about family - well, her lack of family growing up. it seems that this lack of childhood contributes to her difficult time growing up. She is forced to become a woman - marriage and children - but is not fitting into that position.
ReplyDeleteWhen the book began, it seemed to be at the end of Janie's story. When it became clear that she would be relating her story, I expected to hear more about Tea Cake, whom she recently left. I was surprised to see that by chapter four, Janie has already had relationships with two or three other men, none of them Tea Cake. It seems to me that Janie will be on a journey to find the perfect partner during this book.
ReplyDeleteAlong with Amina, I also really liked the end of chapter two, in which Janie became a woman. I felt that this was a prime example of the abstract statement made about women and men at the beginning of the book - Janie is putting away her dream of a perfect world where "marriage compels love, as the sun compels the day." We also see this practical aspect later on during Janie's reaction to her fights with Logan.
ReplyDeleteI think the language used in this book is beautiful and has been chosen very carefully to give a specific image or feeling.
As I began reading Their Eyes Were Watching God I was immediately drawn to the similarities to other works we have read. Like many of the novels we have read this book starts with a different introduction that can be bracketed from the rest of the novel. Another clear connection is to the colloquial language and phonetic spelling for African American dialogue in Huck Finn. As we talked about in class there are parallels to TSL in the opening scene. There are obvious similarities to Incidents in The Life of a Slave Girl. All that said TEWWG has a very unique feel to it both linguistically (with its juxtaposition of romance and colloquialism) and overall
ReplyDeleteDan M
I feel like Janie is extremely immature and self centered. Nanny only wants the best for her but Janie seems to do what Janie feels like doing. Agreed that Logan is a truly troubled man, and often can be seen as cruel, I doubt that his wickedness stems from his and Janie's relationship. I have noticed how fast paced this novel is, which makes Janie's life with Nanny and Logan seem pretty insignificant and what happens later may be far more important.
ReplyDelete--Nathan R.
I dont understand what Janie meant when she said that TeaCake was "gone." However, she told Pheoby a couple things that didnt happen. At the rate that this book is going, we will eventually hear again of this story soon.
ReplyDeleteAt the beginning of the first chapter, we are told that "the dream is the truth." Janie does not like Logan, which is true, and she does not seem to be liking him anymore as time goes on. Janie is not being truthful to herself, thus she is not living her dream at the moment. However, according to the beginning of the book, she will just forget this moment and pursue a new dream as all women do.
It was very interesting (and sad, of course) to read about the history of Nanny, Leafy, and Janie. There were 3 whole generations of slavery, suffering, and cruelty. I'm glad that Janie defied that and left Logan; he is clearly not right for her. She is altering history and changing what happens in their family.
ReplyDeleteI am going to say that the intense, serious, deep, and reflective paragraphs in between the dialogues intrigued me alot. However, along with everyone else, I agree that the dialogues were a little harder to read, since I had to say it aloud in my head in order for me to grasp what the characters were trying to articulate. This book was not like other books whereby I can just breeze through the reading. However, this book seemed rewarding enough in descriptions and deep, insightful sentences.
ReplyDeleteI wanted to point out how much contempt I have for Mayrella and the other bullies who tried to make Janie feel bad. If those girls had so much fun bullying poor Janie, I seriously hope karma has something good installed for them.
I really enjoyed reading about her contemplative moment under the blossoming pear tree, as I have never really understood how such simple things in life could be so profound and so ... sweet. The tranquility of that moment seemed to me like a sanctuary against the horrid and poignant comments about her parents.
I hate the way Janie's grandma broke it to Janie that the whites were racist and treated blacks like lesser beings, "throw down de load and tell de nigger man tuh pick it up" and I hated the way the black men "hand it to his womenfolks." So what now? The black men felt that their ego was hurt by the white men, so they forced their wives to do their work and shoulder the labor? Are they now channeling their bruised ego to sexism and making their wives slaves? "de nigger woman is de mule" (page 14)
I feel bad for her grandma because I understand how marrying a white man would get her protection from the world, seeing how she was abandoned by both parents.
That stupid plantation woman also had some serious issues. So now what? Because Janie's grandma had a baby who looks a little white meant that it gave her the right to slap the poor woman? Like I previously said, I really want to see what karma has installed for her.
(edit: I just realized Janie's grandma was raped by the plantation owner; that makes me sympathize even more with the poor woman)
I found it touching the way Janie's grandma went through all that trouble to raise Janie's mum, and eventually Janie herself. I was so upset when Zora Hurston killed off Janie's grandma, the only woman in this story that I really took a liking to. After all that she had done, the last thing she deserved was to die in a single paragraph. That's about the worst thing a writer can do. *grumbles*
Joe said "Ah'm uh man wid principles" Yeah right! Lets go seduce married woman and inspire them to elope with us, I mean, we are men with principles, right? >.> Come on Janie, your husband has barely been gone for a month and you are having an affair? He has been doing all the hard work and now you want to ditch him? Wow much...
And in the end she ditched him. That poor man married Janie and was reduced to a sobbing mess, and she ditched him for a flirtatious man. Ugh.
- End of random rambles -
Janie's life thus far is very restricted. Due to racism and her gender Janie has no room to move. I really enjoy the style of the writing so far and can't wait to read more about Janie's life.
ReplyDeleteThanks for your comments so far. I am interested that the dialogue is difficult. I guess it's difficult for me, too, but I really enjoy reading it, because it sounds like real people talking to me--and I like the way they seem to say so much more than a lot of other people. The issues are right out there in the open: like when Nanny tells Janie what she's worried about, or Janie and Logan discuss their marriage. And the dialogue strikes me often as nearly as beautiful as the paragraphs in between. On a side note, I'm not sure why Talia should feel shy about saying she likes it that Janie's an independent woman. Feminism should be admirable, not obnoxious. --EC
ReplyDeleteI really like Hurston's style of giving mostly dialogue. It let me know each character better because of the way they said things, rather than by showing the way they acted. Janie's life seems to be very affected by race. Although it doesn't seem as though she has had too much contact with real rough racism, race has defined her life. From when she realized she was not in fact white by seeing a picture of herself her life changed. At school she was made fun of because of her affiliation with white people, a strange twist on racism. And now she is embarking to an all black town to live in. Clearly race is going to play a huge role there. I am interested in seeing where the story will take her. As of now she seems to have no limits besides race; she's with a wealthy man, has no ties at home, and is on the road.
ReplyDelete-Matt Goroff
I agree with Matt in that it seems that Janie actually has quite a bit of freedom, especially when she runs of with Jody. At the same time, she is always in danger of being taken advantage of. It seems as if Hurston is foreshadowing that Janie will soon have to undergo some struggles however.
ReplyDelete-Benny
Though I love the book so far, I really dislike Janie. While I feel bad for her seeing as that she is a dreamer in a world in which she is forced to face harsh realities, her spoiled bratishness makes her extremely unlikable. After hearing how much Nanny went through for her, instead of respecting that, she just pouts and then complains about her husband until she finally leaves him for a man with such high principles that he sees no problem in encouraging a married woman to run away with him. It's one thing to not love or be attracted to her husband, but she takes it to an awful new level by complaining about instead of appreciating all the work he does for her in return for so little. What upset me the most was how she seemed to wait for Nanny to die to disregard all the promises she had made to her.
ReplyDeleteHer actions may be independent, but are by no means shown in an attractive light.
I really like how the scenes are constructed with interesting and specific details. I find the dialogue a little difficult to read, but I enjoy the way it sounds in my head. It sounds very real, as did the dialogue in Huck Finn. The scene when Janie is under the pear tree is quite dramatic and dreamy, and t
ReplyDeletereally hate the main character Janie. The book fails in one of almost every books' objectives of making the reader care for the main protagonist in the book. Despite Janie's troubles, she is no where as unfortunate as the stereotypical lives of a slave we hear about. Even within the book there are minor characters in which we find more notiable traits/feel bad for as Nanny and Nanny's first child(the mother of Janie) both gets raped. However, Janie never gets raped and never really gets beaten.
ReplyDeleteI agree a lot with Ayesha despite weighting what was written above to be of enough importance to tip my general idea of the book to a more negative view
Andrew C
I find it interesting how it switches from narration to conversation. I think the beginning pages that we read in class had so much detail and imagery but when reading the conversation parts I feel like I am able to get a better feel for the tone and what is actually going on even though the narration has such great deep detail.
ReplyDeleteDespite the difficult dialogue, I am really enjoying the book. I like Janie so far because despite her hardship, she stands up for herself. She knows what she wants and fights for it instead of agreeing to the false love she is forced into with Logan by Nanny. I am particularly interested in finding out the role God plays in the novel and how religion or spirituality affects Janie.
ReplyDeleteI have really enjoyed the beginning. I agree with Jamie that the difference between the dialogue and the rest is so distinct and big. It seems a little strange that the descriptions are so detailed and somewhat complex, and the dialogue seems as if it could be coming from a different book altogether.
ReplyDelete-Sydney
Having just read Wuthering Heights over the break, the storytelling aspect of this novel is not as confusing as it would have been - for me, at least. I've always wondered why authors choose to tell stories through other people. That point aside, the beginning is one of the best and most intriguing that I have read in a long time. We learn that Janie is mixed, and that her grandmother felt that God had bestowed her a second chance - another child with whom to create a good future. While I'm still curious about Janie's parents - her mother, in particular - we can make many conjectures about Janie's life. The novel focuses on love and the social conception surrounding marriage; Janie, who probably sought a deeper kind of love-enriched marriage than other girls her age, was unhappy at her gruff, slightly socially awkward but overwhelmingly kind and benevolent husband, who had difficulty expressing his delight in their companionship - but their marriage was ONLY a companionship, and nothing else. When a flashy and socially hip young man came around, she was blinded by his soothing words and ran off with him. I don't dislike Janie, per se, but I acknowledge that she has flaws but she also has high aspirations to live a fulfilling life; that's admirable.
ReplyDeleteThe author definently wants to show the reader that Janie is independent. We see this by her leaving the man the her nanny wanted her to marry. It shows Janie as an adventurous, free spirit. I am curious to see what happens to Janie as a result of her attitude.
ReplyDeleteSo far I have enjoyed the novel, although I feel that it is almost two different books. For it is either difficult and choppy dialogue, or well thought out, beautifully written, descriptions. However, what ties these sides of the book together is the the fact that they both seem to address big issues and they both use lots of metaphors.
ReplyDeleteHenry Lucey
I feel that the dialogue of this book is mirroring the speech almost of Jim in Huck Finn, which going forward may present issues of understanding necessarily what Janie or others are saying. I do feel that it is being used to convey a similar point of the common speech and opinions of the time against African Americans.
ReplyDelete-Ben H
I have enjoyed the book. At first i was a bit confused with the word choices Zora Neale Hurston made but as i read on, I began to piece the puzzle together. What i enjoyed so far was the part when Janie's grandmother was trying to make Janie marry Jonny.
ReplyDeleteI meant MR. Killicks
ReplyDeleteI HATE THIS WRITING! This is so annoying, it's like a hardcore version of Huckleberry Finn, I don't really gets whats going on, and I have to read it out loud a good 6 times before I actually understand it. I'm sure the story is good past all the annoying misspelling and such.
ReplyDeleteWe'll have to talk about the dialect in class. It's not as hard as Matthew makes it out, I think... Or, as the GSA says, "It gets better!"
ReplyDeleteI'm finding the dialect and the writing style really interesting as well. If you try to imagine people actually talking, it's much easier and flows better. But it can be tricky. Overall, I'm enjoying the book so far. It seems that there are many stories within stories and interesting characters. I got so lost in the stories of Nanny and Logan that I even forgot that Janie was even talking to Pheoby in the first place. I don't feel like I know enough about Janie to decide whether I like her or not yet, but she seems to be an adventurous, thoughtful, curious girl and I find her quite relatable in those ways.
ReplyDelete-Elena